ZZL S4 5 | Unconventional Icon Method


Life’s true beauty lies in the unpredictable dance of the zigzag path. Embrace its twists and turns, for within the magical rhythm of uncertainty, you’ll uncover the extraordinary and unleash the full brilliance of your potential. For today’s episode, we dive into the magical realm of Enchantress Shane Kulman, a mentor and guide for creative and sensitive souls seeking an extraordinary and enchanting life. Enchantress Shane discusses her take on the Zigzag life, sharing her path of personal growth and self-development along the way. She discusses the unconventional Icon Method—a powerful framework that ignites the spark of transformation within her clients. Enchantress Shane shares how individuals can embrace their entire selves — both their light and their shadows —  to unlock their most authentic and empowered selves. Tune in now and let the zigzag path lead you to a truly enchanting life! 

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The Unconventional Icon Method: Wonder, Enchantment, And Zigzags With Enchantress Shane Kulman

My guest was such a treat. Let me introduce you to Enchantress Shane. She’s a renowned mentor for creative and sensitive men and women dedicated to helping them live extraordinary and enchanting life. With a deep sense of knowing and a passion for guiding others, Shane has built a reputation as a transformative force in the field of personal growth and self-development.

Shane drew on her extensive knowledge, intuition, and enchanting energy to create The Unconventional Icon Method. Shane brings a whirlwind of inspirational insights to her private clients, group programs, workshops, and retreats. Her unique approach is rooted in joy and the integration of darkness and shadow, empowering her clients to embrace their whole selves and unlock their whole potential. Enjoy the show.

Shane, how are you?

I’m so glad to be here.

I am so happy that you are. Now, I’m looking at your zig-zag earrings. That was very serendipitous, not on purpose. I love it. I always start it off by asking people what their thoughts are on the zig-zag path and anything you want to share. I’m thrilled that you’re here. I love seeing you on social media. I’ve never met you in person, but seeing you and watching you, I felt an instant connection with you and I’m grateful that you’re on. This is very exciting.

I love to start the day by speaking like this because I have quiet mornings, so it feels like this is my intention. I want to be here talking about this stuff that matters.

Tell me. What is your feeling on the zig-zag of life?

It’s funny when you say that. I think it was those little circle creatures. There was Mr. Ziggy. There was Miss Perfectionist, and all those little Mr. and Mrs. Creatures. That’s what comes to my mind at first. I love the idea that in school, there’s a lot of talk about straight and narrow. It’s like, “You have to be focused on the straight and narrow.” That could probably be the worst advice anybody could give a child. It’s basically saying like, “Don’t be curious. Look straight ahead. Don’t look up, don’t look to the left, don’t look to the right.” That’s where life happens. It’s all around. I love the zig-zag of like, “I’m going here. No, I’m going there.”

One of the things you said one day when you were doing a live was that some friends of yours said that you were scatterbrained. I relate to that because my mind works very similarly. I have many interests, so I am multi-passionate. It was something that irked me. This was years ago. One of my college roommates said this to me. She was very directed in her life. She didn’t go in many different directions. She passed away, which is horrible. She passed away at a young age. It’s just certain people have this one path, and that’s okay, but other people are meant to go in many different directions.

That’s very kind of you, and I’m sorry about your friend. It’s more natural that everybody goes zig-zag. Never mind magic or quantum physics, but science shows that especially women’s brains are all over the place. We make sense of things, and we have logic about things in very different ways. To go against that seems unhealthy to me.

ZZL S4 5 | Unconventional Icon Method
Unconventional Icon Method: It’s more natural that everybody goes zigzag because science shows that specialty women’s brains are actually all over the place. And we make sense of things and have logic about things in very different ways.

I love the way you see the world. I want to start from the beginning to hear your story.

I was always in trouble as a kid. I was in a gifted and talented program, which meant I was very curious and talkative. This is what it meant to me. That was not how it was. Teachers didn’t know any better. It was about, “Sit down and be quiet.” That’s what it was about. All along the way, I became a teacher. I was a Marketing major. I was going home crying every night because it was all about charts, linear, and numbers. I couldn’t get it because there was so much reasoning in there. I’m like, “This is a liability, but what if you see it in a different light, then it’s not a liability anymore.” There was more discussion than I needed to have.

I switched to education. I became a preschool teacher and then a therapist. At the same time, I was a stripper. I was working in nightclubs in the city, not to pay for college. I came from a nice Jewish home where I had a bat mitzvah. They paid for college. I didn’t know, but I was searching for freedom. I was searching for myself. It was wild and not for a short stint. It was eleven years that I was stripping, going to work at night, and then coming back to work in the morning. It is very similar populations needing boundaries, seeking joy, and men and children. I do this in my comedy act. It’s funny, but it’s true. Men and children love playing, and they’re given spaces to do so and women are not.

What was the famous place in the ‘60s on the East side?

Was it Scores?

Yes. I was in the food business and I’m bringing all my samples to the chef. I remember all the women coming in, and I’m like, “Who’s the smart one here? They’re making a fortune.”

I love that you went in there. We all have some tie to a strip club or some opinion. To me, it was where I got to myself. I was self-loathing. I hated myself. I got a nose job at sixteen. I wouldn’t look up. I wouldn’t look at anybody. I got in the mirror, and I was like, “I think I’m pretty.” There was something when I used to watch MTV videos, and I knew I belonged on a strip club stage or a video. I started out waitressing from an ad in the village voice. Talk about zig-zag. I was still at college when I started. It was great. I got to speak with men, and I got to learn.

I was doing the therapy that I would eventually be training for without realizing it. I got to like myself, and I got to live this childhood dream of being a solid gold dancer or video vixen. It was so fun. I had one bad experience where a guy asked me if I ate Oreo cookies late at night, and that was mean. I’m like, “I would’ve rather you proposition me for something unruly than say that.” Other than that, it was a lovely experience.

One uncomfortable experience in this entire time. That is wild.

I found a sisterhood in the dressing room. We laughed, we shared, and we got ready together. Talk about past life regressions. It felt like a temple where we were getting in our sacred makeup and clothing. We shared secrets. We were from all different colors, shapes, and sizes. It was magnificent.

You do make a fortune doing that.

We made nice amounts. I did a lot of talking. I have my own stuff around. There would be guys that were like, “Are you going to actually dance?” I’m like, “Yes.” I loved talking to people. I was a therapist, and I hated that system. It was horrible. I was working with kids with special needs. I worked with kids teaching theater. They were in prison. My zig-zags are all over the place. If you get to think about the big picture, they’re not. It’s about connection. It’s about seeing people and making them great no matter where I meet them.

ZZL S4 5 | Unconventional Icon Method
Unconventional Icon Method: Our zigzags are really all over the place. But if you get to think about the big picture, it’s about connection. It’s about really seeing people and making them great no matter where I meet them.

When you are meeting them, they are called to go and meet with you as with any of the people that you’re working with. It’s interesting in terms of a connection. Do you know right off the bat? Are there certain people that you work with that they’re not open to? I’m wondering because I feel coming to meet with you, they’re already open to a point.

Yes. There are a lot of people who are closed. I had a one-woman show called Fuck Your Fears. Several people were scared just to even go to a show because they were so afraid. I have a lot of fears. I’m not the fear guru. It’s the reason I teach how people to go beyond their limitations and fears is because I have so many that I know how to do it.

We conquer them when we face them versus avoiding them. I do have that. I love that line, “You resist, it persists.” I do feel it is important to confront what you’re dealing with.

Because I’m such a fearful person, I don’t like confronting them face-on. I am an avoider, so I like to do the backdoor, a workaround, or trick my ego into allowing myself to have these big uncomfortable feelings through play.

I love what you’re saying. Leading up to talking to you, it’s always like, “Whatever’s on my mind, I love to discuss.” This is a perfect time to ask, which is confrontation with friends. I don’t like awkward moments with people. I often am the type of person who if it isn’t going so well or somebody is bothering me, I’d often run for the hills. At this point in my life, it’s an interesting concept. Not really run for the hills, but if it’s not working, then I always feel like, “Let’s take a break.”

You always hope that the right people will come back. I always have that open-door feeling. A lot of people have an ego and they get personally offended if you need to take a pause. I do believe that you’re either jiving or you’re not. You’re on different wavelengths. It has a lot to do with energy, frequency, and all that quantum stuff. How do you feel? Do you have these uncomfortable times? If someone is bothering you and irking you, do you let it naturally fade or do you bring up the conversation?

First of all, I create awkward moments by accident, but because I feel people so deeply, it’s so obvious. I can’t override. I get annoyed pretty quickly. What I’ve trained myself to do is to get curious. If it’s somebody that matters to me, like someone that I have connected to that I would call a friend, not just a random in a group, if it’s a random in a group, I will pull my energy back. That’s not true. At first, I’ll dive in. I’m like, “How does it feel to be you right now?” If somebody’s being a complete weirdo, I’m like, “That’s cool that they could allow themselves to have such an impact on a group without realizing it.” I will get curious. If they don’t seem to be interested in my way, then I’m like, “That’s fine.”

There are instances where it’s like there was a group, some friends, some not friends and it was time to go eat. Everybody can relate to this. There was someone who was like, “I’m eating this way.” They made this declaration. Another woman was like, “I want to sit down. It can’t be too loud.” There were two people. One was the peacemaker. “I know. Let’s get a place,” getting on the phone trying to work, and make a peace thing. I was watching it all go down and I’m like, “I’m going to eat. I’m hungry. There’s no way I’m relying on anyone else to meet my needs. What are my options?” I wrote a thing about this.

“I’m doing this way of eating now. It feels good in my body, so I’m going to make sure these two restaurants I can pick from. These are the options.” Decision-making is where the awkwardness comes from. Whatever a person is feeling that they’re not owning comes out messy. It creates awkwardness. If someone doesn’t want to be there but they feel obligated, then they’re going to start acting out in certain ways. It’s like little kids. That will push somebody’s button, which is what their subconscious wants. It’s like, “I’m not happy, so who else can I make not happy?”

If someone doesn’t want to be there, but feel obligated, then they’re going to start acting out in certain ways.

That’s exactly the point. When someone isn’t happy, they create problems. They’ll create chaos. They’ll create something.

Especially around eating and food. It’s the easiest place. When we’re not hungry, what do we do? We bug out. It brings up everybody’s stuff, like the people pleaser. It’s like, “I’ll eat wherever you want to eat.” It’s like, “No, you don’t want to do that. You want to eat something.” People don’t make decisions, and then they’re on the fence and they’re mad at themselves.

I feel like a lot of people walk around in this state where they’re annoyed at themselves for either over-giving, for feeling obligated, and then you’re resentful. The happiest person in this space usually gets the brunt of it. I had a woman once. We’re sitting upstate, the same place where somebody called me a scatterbrain, and I was saying something positive.

A friend who I guess wasn’t a friend said, “You are always so happy.” I was like, “You’re staying in my house.” She was so resentful, and it burst out of her. I wasn’t trying to annoy her, but she was a negative person. I was 30, but I was still in this place of like, “Everybody’s a friend. This is so nice.” I was like, “This woman’s got to go. She was a misery.”

That’s exactly what I’m talking about because that happens. Often, if I am talking about positivity and if someone is sad or depressed and they’re hearing what I’m saying, they’re not hearing what I’m saying because it’s an energy. It’s literally a frequency. It’s interesting reading up on energy signatures. I wrote a little thing on human connection and energy signatures because that’s all we are. We’re an energy pattern.

If you’re with someone, forget about the emotions of it. I pretty much take it as we’re not vibing. I’m not even overly positive. It’s just my perception of the world on how I deal with things. I would like to look at things in this way because I believe that’s how we manifest stuff. Other people would be, “It’s too high of a pitch. It’s too fast.” Someone said, “You’re speaking very quickly.” It’s also because maybe the other person is, for me, speaking too slowly. I’m trying to pitch the same level and it’s not jiving. It’s an interesting thing to look at when you are clashing with the person to see what the energy is on both ends and get the story out.

Now I get a kick out of it. I don’t have a lot of people who aren’t into me. That comes from a shadow as a child of being afraid of confrontation and having a loud house. Living in Brooklyn, things were scary when people were yelling. Now I’m so right all over the place. It’s like, “Bring it. Come to me with some negativity.”

One time, a woman did a sales call with me. She wanted to work with me and she couldn’t. Years later, she wrote this very nasty, almost as if she went in precision into my deepest wound and said something mean. The joy was that my heart didn’t clench. I didn’t get scared. I was like, “It didn’t even affect me.” I was so grateful for her for showing up like that because I knew she was angry that she couldn’t work with me. It was too much for her. What you were talking about is the frequency. My frequency was too dialed up. She couldn’t reach and she thought, “It’s not for me, so you should go down to mine.” I’m like, “Sorry.”

It’s interesting that you’re saying that too. Are you familiar with Lee Harris? I speak about him a lot. He’s a channeler. He channels this entity or he calls it the Zs. He’s wonderful. He’s a British man. I listened to his lecture. This was right before COVID. I heard him in the city. It struck me because he was talking about how energy healers and helpers often go down to the client’s level.

In the past, we’ve tried to meet people where they are, but he looked at it in a different way like, “Be the role model. Be at that level. The way you would the world to be at that higher vibration helps them rise up.” It’s similar to what you’re saying. At least that’s what made me think of him when you said that.

They call it dumbing down in schools. If you do that, it’s a leakage of energy. It’s energy-sucking. If you realize that you did it, you come home tired. You’re like, “Why am I so exhausted?”

It’s an interesting concept. I love that we could bring in real experiences but then look at it in this energy, which it is.

I love making people see things that are very practical because, for that reason, it’s like, “I’m not other. I’m the same. I maybe have some luck, but I’ve worked. I have put in the risks, and so everybody can put in those risks.” When you’re saying some people have a straight and narrow, I’m like, “No.” They’re just not listening to the energies, fairies, and the things that are like, “Wait, go right. Make a right turn.” They’re like, “No, I was told to go left.”

I love these conversations because we all can tune in and listen if it’s our intuitive voice. I believe it is God or our guides. We are not alone. We’re open, and we begin to receive the help and the guidance that’s here, and we all have it, but I do think it’s the left-brainers and the right-brainers. The left-brainers are more rational and logical. I think more men are more left brain and sometimes we have to say it in their words for them to understand. They want practicality. They want what they think is more literal or real versus the dreamers, the creatives. Everyone that is maybe a little bit more, there’s a feminine aspect to it.

We need both. We can’t be all airy and right-brained. It isn’t healthy. We need to land it and like, “I need to show up here at 11:00.” We need to have that harmony of both. It’s great. To touch on the brain again, if you look at the synapses of thought with a man, it is very linear and straight in the brain. In a woman’s brain, you can see it all lights up all over the place. When you talk about one thing, a man can listen to that one thing. A woman’s brain is like, “The one thing, it’s connected to five things.” I’m going to find that video. I must have seen it when I was 12 or 13 on PBS. It was fascinating. It stuck with me.

Thank you because I love the scientific exploration of all this as well because you can balance spirituality and science. I finished a class with Dolores Cannon, Quantum Healing Hypnosis Technique. I have been practicing past life regression for about a decade, but I’m diving more deeply into her work. There is an incredible book that I’m reading. It’s called The Convoluted Universe by Dolores Cannon. She takes it all to another level. It is the nature of our reality and who we are. It’s a more expanded thought. I do think that she helped so many people move forward. It’s interesting. She does talk about the left and the right brain in her practice.

Once we are in a relaxed state, that’s when we are more receptive. That’s when we can zoom in to the grander us. She does connect, which I’m now understanding and is so incredibly real, our over soul, our higher self. Literally, people are connecting to that part of them where true wisdom is coming through knowledge, male and female, because we are male and female in many different incarnations. As we’re born, we’re not only one sex, so it is merging the two. It is bringing us as humanity an understanding to release that, which I don’t know if we’ll ever release more of that polarity. It’s conflict. It’s an interesting concept. I would love to hear a little bit more about your work. The name of your group is?

Now the name of my women’s group is the Enchantress Society. It’s on Facebook. It’s a free group. It’s all about self-expression and pushing your edge through self-expression in order to take it to another level. That’s your level. Everybody has a different level. There’s no like, “I have to get to this level.” It’s like, “No, your next level,” whatever that means.

It’s open and we’re not in competition for the highest level of being. It doesn’t exist. In our reality, I do think that that hierarchy and that seems to be how we process things. You graduate this grade, then you go on to college, then you go on to graduate school and you continue. It is somewhat of an upward look to it, and it’s more expansive. It’s also how our brains work.

It’s what society shows us, and you get bonus points on your taxes if you’re married. If you have kids, you get more bonuses. Basically, we all begin in this trap of what comes next. Who’s to say what comes next? I have a friend. She’s 49 and she just had a baby. Is she doing it wrong? She’s going to die before her kid. There are plenty of terrible situations that happened that nobody could account for, but there’s this society we live in that wants to blame and shame and calculate what’s next.

I don’t like that society. It doesn’t feel good. It’s based on comparison. It’s based on spending money. I live in my own reality. I was broke as a joke. Now I live at the beach in the ocean. I make six figures. I’m chilling until 7:00. I’m going to my friend’s pantry opening. He is donating all this food. You can create what you want to do every day. There are a lot of positive people out there that are not willing to look at their darkness because it’s too uncomfortable.

You can actually create what you want to do every day

That’s the artificial positivity, faking it until you make it, or putting on a front for the world when inside, you’re hurting. If someone asks, “How are you?” then you’re not in the best mood, how do you respond?

I love to say, “Do you really want to know? If you don’t, that’s totally fine. I’ll give you a breezy answer. If you want to know, I’d love to have a conversation, not be on the fly.” Somebody could be like, “I don’t know.” That means no. It’s like, “Cool. How are you?” That’s what they want to talk about.

When you’re talking about how you’re living your life now, it does seem to be a success story where you write your own day and there’s a freedom to your life, which is so beautiful. Everyone wants to get to that point. A lot of people are still in survival mode where they feel trapped and stuck. That’s why I wanted to create this show as a sense of hope or a sense of understanding how we can move out of that feeling of suffering and be allowed to be because we all want to be and not hope for the next. “I can’t wait for summer. The weather is warmer. I can’t wait for the next thing in my life.”

I love the times when I am satisfied. We all come to this moment where we have to work it to get to a place where we feel at peace. Often, that is the zig-zag. We’re working. We have to get to the next thing to feel at ease. We then feel at ease. We’re in that moment of pause, and things are where we want them to be, and then it could get chaotic again. We have to juggle it all over again. It’s okay to have both because I don’t think we could always be in that state of being because we’re human. We’re here to learn too.

That’s it. Instead of the word healing, I like the word to learn because there’s no right or wrong in learning. The word healing, I know a lot of people use it as, “That must mean something’s broken.” If I have a booboo, it’s got to heal. The name of my method is the Unconventional Icon. I love the word unconventional because one can’t have a similar path or a similar zig-zag to anybody else. You can try different things. You can try this diet, you can try this healer, you can try this modality, but your arrangement of your parts, of all of your life experiences, created these parts in us. They’re all different.

You can’t have a similar zigzag path with anybody else. You can try different things. You can try this diet, you can try this modality. But your arrangement of your parts, of all of your life experiences, created these parts in us. They’re all different. 

That’s the piece where when we get to learn about ourselves, then we can be like, “I have a part that’s like a firefighter that needs to move quick, make a phone call, and get a fire brigade going.” That is very reactionary. It’s too fast for us to embody what is happening. Learning these parts is so key to making choices and decisions, and that’s where people are stuck in decision-making. They call it stuck overall, but there are decisions that are in their way.

One of my modalities is Akashic field healing. The other one is past life regression. A lot of people come because they don’t know which road to take, “Should I take this class? Should I do what I’m doing? Should I continue with what I’m doing?” I do feel only the oversoul knows and oversoul wants you to go in the right direction for you, not necessarily what the other direction is for the other person.

It’s for your past specifically because some people came to earth, I believe, that they haven’t had that many past lives. Other people, we’ve had thousands of lives. We’re always here to learn a lesson. It’s the purpose of your life. I’m laughing when one person says, “How come I’m having issues with this particular thing and the next person isn’t? Why do I have the problem?” I said, “That’s one issue that you have that they don’t have, but then they have another problem that you don’t have.” We all have our strengths and our weaknesses. Understand that it’s your story, your energy signature, your life completely, and you can’t look at the next

Looking at the next is seeking comfort. We want comfort as humans. That’s why little kids do the same thing. “How come she didn’t get in trouble and I did?” It’s all of our little inner children that are stampeding around this earth being like, “It’s not fair.”

Some people don’t go to a past life. They just re-experience those early years. That’s wonderful. What seems to happen is the images that are coming through are the good ones to help empower them because we get stuck on the little traumas, the little things that were frozen in time. If we can remember the moment that you’re on the swing, or the moment that you’re riding on the little green bicycle, if we remember those and had an enhanced feeling and pretty much on that swing for infinity, then they come out of this experience with a more peaceful way.

I don’t think we have the tools at a young age because, at a young age, we do get stuck if so and so said something means to us. We forgot the pleasure that we had on this swing. When we could come in as our adult selves and hold the hands of the little kid, that’s when the feeling takes place. I loved when I saw you on another live talking in your five-year-old voice. You put me in such a good mood that day because you have a natural way of talking in that playful voice.

I love what you’re talking about because it is natural and human to only remember the bad stuff when you’re not feeling good in your life. When you’re feeling great, often people don’t look for healers, help, and support when they’re feeling great. It’s a great value to be connected to those moments of joy. There are super smart people like myself who, if something’s going on that doesn’t feel good now, thinking of, “This stuff used to be so good.” There’s a way to manipulate even remembering joy. That’s where the work is. That’s where it’s like, “I have a part of me that wants to squash the joy.” It is seeing it as a character that came in and was like, “Don’t get too happy.”

It is natural and human to only remember the bad stuff when it comes to when you’re not feeling good in your life.

I’m sure we’ve all heard that as little kids like, “Get off your high horse. Don’t be too happy,” all these weird sentences that elders said to us as a kid, whether they were teachers or family or some clown on the street that was like, “Your little girl has confidence,” or some tone of voice that shut a kid down. That gets into the cells of our body and our DNA and our blueprint, and then we seek out. This is going far and beyond, but people who have received abuse from loved ones think like, “This is love,” not in their logical waking mind. That’s how abuse and stuff continue.

The last person that I interviewed was a psychic. She talked a lot about programming. She was a therapist, but she stopped working in that arena because she felt that once the program is finished, we wake up and move on like, “Why do people stay in abusive relationships?” She says, “It’s in the DNA. You’re programmed to be in this situation. When it’s over, it’s over.” How come one day people could walk away from a bad situation? To me, it’s an a-ha moment, “Am I accepting this?” It’s this other part of us like, “How did I allow this to happen?”

It is another part that has the opportunity to come in when there’s clarity. I had that with my second boyfriend. I was 22. It was so bad. He was so mean. It wasn’t physically mean, but it was emotionally tragic. One day, I was like, “What the hell am I doing?” I went there, the door was open, I took some clothes, and I was like, “I’m out of this mess. I’m 22. I’m a great human.” You’re right. I’ve never dated like that again. It was a one-shot deal. Some people need to learn that lesson again and again. Look at Tina Turner who passed away. There’s a shining example of a tragic, physically abusive relationship. At 42, she became a real big rockstar. It’s incredible.

She’s a perfect example. She’s such an icon. I love listening to all these women across the decades that have overcome. I think that it is part of the culture. You look at what was happening in the rest of the world and how we accept things. I was also watching Brooke Shields’s documentary. I loved it. I don’t know if you saw it.

I haven’t, but I will.

It’s wonderful to see how women also have grown over the last 100 years. We’ve come far.

We’ve come so far, and it all comes through our voices. Anything, everything, whether you’re speaking it, singing it, or taking a deep breath, that’s it. Those three things. Breath is so important. That state of being hypes up the nervous system. I’m into health a lot these days for myself. I don’t teach it, although I’m preaching it now. The idea of it is when we can be in that equanimity or that state of being where we are satisfied, it’s actual medicine.

People satisfy us, experiences, and food. The buzzwords now are transformation, transmutation, and healing. I feel it’s a little played out. We should search for satisfaction. It’s funny.

I can tell you where satisfaction comes from. It’s taking a risk and then having it be okay. It’s very simple. It could be something like making a choice in restaurants and being like, “Here’s what we should do, guys.” It is making a leadership decision and then having it work out. The only thing that’s in the way of all of that is our minds which scare us that want to keep us small and safe.

If the leader doesn’t have an ego, the better good of all of us is in a nice way. People are inspired by that. Even as kids, when you have a bossy friend, it’s such a turnoff. It is all in the voice. It’s what the end goal is. We want everyone to be happy. It’s not primarily to get you to the best restaurant for yourself. We have to make a decision and we don’t want to be at a standstill and not eat.

I have a newsletter going out that describes it so much because there are so many needs. As we get older, we have more needs like gluten or it can’t be too loud. It’s good to know those needs, but to be a relaxed leader is the goal. That, to me, is an icon. There’s no push and also be available to say, “This is not for me. I’m going to go. It was nice seeing you all.”

It’s that feeling of force. You can’t force anything. If it’s not working, that’s where we’re pushing. I’ve read somewhere and I don’t remember where, but we’re being pulled into the future. When we’re pushing ourselves through, it’s the hustle that was always very important in our culture. That was looked at as a wonderful trait. Now it’s more going with ease and going with where you’re guided to go in a different way.

That’s a skill to tune in and listen to oneself without the noise, without wondering, “If I say what I want, is no one going to me? Am I going to cause a problem?” As women, we’ve been trained to be good hostesses and be lovely. I remember my friend’s wedding when I read this thing. It was the 1957 Good Housekeeping Law of Being A Good Wife. It’s terrible. It’s like, “Speak in hushed tones, put a bow in your hair, and wait to be spoken to.” It is terrible, but so many women are still living by that guide without realizing it.

ZZL S4 5 | Unconventional Icon Method
Unconventional Icon Method: It’s a skill to really tune in and listen to oneself without the noise. Without wondering, “If I say what I really want is no one going to like me? Am I going cause a problem?”.

It’s part of our subconscious. That’s exactly what the documentary with Brooke Shields was talking about. You have to see it because she was explaining it. She couldn’t believe that she went along with it so well. She was such a good girl. She agreed because she was the breadwinner for her and her mother. It was very interesting because a lot of what you’re talking about was displayed in that film. She’s incredible. She has a wonderful life now. What a wonderful mother she is. She would never allow her girls to go through what she went through. That’s part of the culture too. Whatever she was going through in those years, she was the only one. She was explaining rising up as a young girl, there weren’t that many celebrities at her age.

I don’t know much, but her mother would go on all the interviews with her.

That’s what she discussed. Mom was coined the stage mother. She was the quintessential stage mother. She ruled her whole life and finally broke away.

I didn’t know that piece. I also think about Drew Barrymore. That was a mess, but still, also a young child star who was doing cocaine at thirteen. She also has her own talk show. She’s fabulous. She’s transparent.

She had Brooke on her talk show. I love all the work that you’re doing. I find you to be so inspiring. In addition to your group and your counseling one-on-one, you also stand-up comedy.

I’m a stage whore. I love doing anything. It’s the fastest track towards anything of the next level because it puts your whole state of being in witness. You get to be witnessed by strangers, by real people. You can go to an open mic or you can do it online. It’s so freeing. I’m a theater-trained actress, improv, and I told you I’m studying sacred clowning now. Anything to do with self-expression is the best way to heal.

ZZL S4 5 | Unconventional Icon Method
Unconventional Icon Method: Anything to do with self-expression is the best way to heal.

 You don’t even know you want to heal. You’re up there because our brains don’t know what we need a lot of times. We need to be in our bodies in a position of power. People will see that and, automatically, we win no matter what we think of ourselves. They’re like, “She’s on stage. I could never do that.” You automatically win. It could be a podcast or a video on YouTube. It doesn’t need to be a physical stage, although that’s the best place. It could be anywhere. To be seen, to be heard, and to be witnessed, that’s where the quickest, most efficient magic is.

You say that you have fear. Do you have the jitters before you go on or the adrenaline’s going and you know what you’re going to say like Marvelous Mrs. Maisel?

No. I have a lot of insecurities. I did a show at Gotham Comedy and I nailed it. I knew I was going to nail it. It was set up for success. I did another show that week. It was part of a music fest. I know what happened. First of all, it’s a music fest. People aren’t paying attention to the stage. They’re with their friends. Now I’m like, “Now I’m here.” My material was great. What wasn’t great, and this is just to share, is my energy started leaking out, which was like, “Do you like me? Is this good? Can you laugh?” The feeling permeated the room like, “What the hell?”

I’m confident, Shane’s great, and then all of a sudden, I’m in my neighborhood. It was a local event. It felt so bad. There were people that were like, “It was great.” It’s not about the audience. It’s about how I feel. This goes for anything. How many shows, dates, or dinners have you done, produced, or put on and you think it was terrible and everyone else thinks it was great? You are right. If it wasn’t a fun, fulfilling experience, it’s something to learn from. I didn’t kill it. It wasn’t like, “That was amazing.” I was like, “Why do I do this?”

It’s you being you. When we are 100% in our authenticity and we feel good, it’s not even the applause. It’s when we know we’re being the most ourselves. We’re in our element. It’s interesting how you’re saying that because I can relate. I can relate to many different experiences whether or not it’s with people, clients, or everything in life. Don’t party where I feel off.

The third part of my method is called Strut the Stage. It’s always about owning it. I even tried to own it on the mic. I was like, “Why do I do this? This feels terrible. The traction wasn’t there. Does it mean I’m going to quit? No, I have another show Wednesday tomorrow.”

Keep on going because this is your passion. You’ll never stop because this is something that you enjoy. You win some and you lose some. I know that we have to wrap up soon, but I saw your latest about confidence. It’s a perfect end note leading right into what we’re talking about, which is owning whatever you’re experiencing. If you have the energy leak, you have the energy leak. We’ll write it off whatever the reason was.

It’s humbling. I need to be humbled every so often. We need our egos. We need to feel like, “I’m great. My ideas matter,” or nothing will ever come out.

That’s what we all relate to. It’s being real. The more we keep on trying to be mannequins, it’s impossible. That’s the fluidity of who we are as human beings. To finish off, I would like to ask about your latest about confidence. Any little gems that you want to share about these thoughts?

I want everyone to know it’s okay to own it and it’s okay to not rationalize like, “What am I learning from this?” Have the moment where you feel crappy. Have the moment where you feel angry. Let the tears out and not try to get to the happiness. It’s not comfortable, but it’s necessary. How I did it was when I was younger, I would override it. It would implode and then I self-hated.

Have the moment where you feel crappy. Have the moment where you feel angry. Let the tears out and not try to get to the happiness. It’s not comfortable. It’s not comfortable but it’s necessary.

If you speak out loud, “I’m not having a good time tonight. I’m going to go home,” it’s better than saying, “It was so good to see you.” No, it wasn’t. You didn’t want to leave the house. I feel you being miserable. Be like, “I’m off tonight. I’m going to go home. It’s not you.” Here’s the thing. It’s not just do that. We have to learn the language of that. We were not trained. We didn’t have movies that spoke like that. They were like, “It’s so good to see you,” in that annoying voice.

I feel that we over-compliment a lot at times towards the end of things. We’re not feeling it so we’re trying to make it right. We’re trying to make it better. Yours doesn’t stop with the platitudes. Someone once said those words to me, “Stop the platitudes because you’re not feeling it.”

I had a friend once and she said to me, “I didn’t have a good time at your birthday.” At first, I was like, “Yes, me neither.” It was the truth. I wanted it to be different but I had invited weird people and it didn’t work. I wanted bodies in the room, and then she said it was boring. We have that friendship and I was so glad. I laughed my ass off.

That’s what makes it all real. I relate to what you’re saying. That happened once. I went over to this girl and said, “That party that you have was horrible.” She felt so good because she was like, “No.” It’s pressure to have to try to make everything so great and awesome. I think we got the message. We can talk forever, but everyone could feel what we’re saying. It’s an important message. Thank you. Anything you want to share about what you’re up to so all the readers can come and read about you?

I would say go to Google and play a little game. Type in Shane Kulman or Enchantress Shane. Read, follow, and link up. See where your zig-zag guides you to reach me. If you don’t want to be in a group, if you want to work one-on-one, or if you want to listen, go to YouTube. Do whatever you want. If you’re attracted to this, and you’ve stayed this long, I invite you to jump on board. You’re invited. It’s all-inclusive. You’re never too old, too fat, too skinny, too rich, or too poor. There’s something for you.

Thank you, Shane. You’re awesome. I appreciate it. I’m looking forward to speaking to you soon. Enjoy the day.

You too.


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authentic self, connection, enchantment, self expression, unconventional icon method, zigzag life

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